2 Soft Compounds
2 Soft Compounds is a weekly podcast focusing on Formula 1, hosted by radio broadcaster Rick Houghton and motorsport journalist and GrandPrix247 founder, Paul Velasco.
With a focus on unfiltered analysis, behind-the-scenes insights and expert commentary, the podcast offers fans an entertaining and informative take on the fastest sport in the world.
2 Soft Compounds
Attack of the Blue Ferraris: Miami Madness & Motorsport Realities
Attack Of The Blue Ferraris: Miami Madness & Motorsport Realities
šļø Racing Realities & Ruthless Champions ā This week on 2 Soft Compounds, Rick and Paul are joined by rising F3 star Hugh Barter for a no-nonsense look at what it really takes to make it in motorsport.
š° Ā£5 million. Thatās the price tag Hugh drops for a proper shot at F3 and F2. Itās a brutal wake-up call about the financial mountain young drivers must climb - before they even get near Formula 1.
š§ Hugh also shares sharp insights on adaptability, calling it one of the most underrated but essential skills in racing. Even legends like Hamilton can struggle when the car doesnāt suit their style. As Hugh puts it: āYou're always having to adapt to whateverās thrown at you on a racetrack.ā
š¤ Plus the guys go deep on the championās mindset - what separates the greats from the nearly-greats! From Verstappenās āif we crash, we crashā aggression to the ice-cold instincts of Senna and Schumacher, the guys discuss the old addage that ruthlessness isnāt optional at the top.
šŗšø Plus: there's the obligatory look ahead to the Miami Grand Prix, including Ferrariās divisive livery change and why the circuit still feels, wellā¦ awkward.
Podcast Rundown
1ļøā£ Episode Introduction
2ļøā£ Hugh Barter's Racing Journey
3ļøā£ Funding Challenges in Motorsport
4ļøā£ Driver Mentality and Adaptation
5ļøā£ Ruthlessness Required for Champions
6ļøā£ Miami GP Preview and Predictions
Production Credits:
Presented by: Rick Houghton & Paul Velasco
Studio Engineer & Editor: Roy D'Monte
Executive Producer: Ian Carless
Produced by: GrandPrix247 & W4 Podcast Studio
Hi, welcome to the Two Soft Compounds podcast. Before we begin, I've got a quick favour to ask. There's one simple way you can support our show, and that's by hitting that follow or subscribe button on the app you're listening to the show on right now. It really does make a huge difference in helping us get the show out there to as many people as possible, so please give us a hand and click that button right now. Thank you.
Paul Velasco:I don't make mistakes. I make prophecies that immediately turn out to be wrong.
Rick Houghton:Anything can happen in Formula One, and it usually does. Welcome to another edition of Two Soft Compounds the Formula One podcast, with myself, rick, and Paul Velasco, the chief editor and founder of GrandPrix247.com. We're also joined today by a very special guest. It's Mr Hugh Barter. Hugh, welcome to us. Hugh's raced in Formula Four, formula Three a massive karting career behind him of course as well. Hugh, hello to you. Hello, thanks for having me Much appreciated no, much appreciated you joining us because we want to tap into your insight.
Rick Houghton:A little bit later on, we're going to talk about driver transition Now. You've raced in different series. You've come from karting, which most drivers start in. You've raced in different formulas. One question I have for you is we talked about this on the podcast quite a lot over the last few weeks is, for instance, lewis hamilton trying to justify his racing style with a different car? So he's gone, obviously, from mercedes to ferrari and we've seen him struggle adapting to the new car. You've obviously had to do similar things yourself, hugh. When it's come to moving between different series and moving between different cars, how is it that it's so difficult for some drivers, including world-class drivers like Lewis Hamilton? How is it so difficult to adapt from one car to the other, do you think?
Hugh Barter:I think, I mean I would say I would argue that having a good adaptability skills is a crucial element to being a good driver. I mean, you're always having to adapt to conditions, to whatever's really thrown at you out on a racetrack, like the sport, has so many variables. So it is your job as a driver to be able to just take everything in and then make the best of what you've got. In saying that, I would say that I personally wouldn't know. You know, jumping from one team to another like especially in F1, where it's not a spec series where so much can change how different the driving style is going to be, but I mean jumping from F4 to F3, or even recently I went from F3 to jumping into, like a Formula Regional car.
Hugh Barter:It is extremely different, but I wouldn't say it should take, you know, half a season or a full season. I mean Howenton's also been driving the Merc, for you know what it's like seven years now. So to go from you know one car that you've driven or a driving start that you've had for seven years and then to switch over, especially, I mean, as you get older it becomes harder to adapt to new environments. Maybe that plays a big part. But yeah, it's definitely a crucial element to have and, to be honest, I'm a little bit surprised that he is still saying that I mean, but you know, it's just how it is.
Paul Velasco:Well spoken like a veteran. Before we move on, you just tell us exactly where you are in your career right now, if you don't mind.
Hugh Barter:So in my career, I'm in a little bit of a limbo state due to funding. I didn't actually finish the F3 season in 2023 due to my sponsor having to pull out. Nothing against him, it's just how it goes sometimes. Pull out, nothing against him, it's just how it goes sometimes. And then in 2024 I basically didn't do any sort of racing due to the fact that I just lacked funding. It's pretty hard to get to get any sort of sponsorship, especially when you aren't racing. It's sort of a catch-22 situation that you need to get funding to go racing, but you also need to be racing to get funding. And then recently, uh, been lucky enough to race in a small series here in france called the huzzia cup. It actually goes all around europe, but yeah, so I mean we're doing that at the moment, seeing how it goes, I mean there's no guarantee that I do the full season, but at the moment we've done the first two rounds and yeah mate, and you're being very modest because you know what he cleaned up paul ricard bam.
Paul Velasco:He won all the all three races. I mean, what a what a weekend. And you were a rookie, you're like a rookie winner and you won the actual outright thing all three races. That's pretty amazing for a guy just jumping into the car for the first time. Well, that's cool, good to have you on, yeah, but you're still very far from formula one, right, like what? A hundred million dollars far yeah, I mean it's.
Hugh Barter:I think f3 is more or less now. I'd say, to be comfortable, you need a mil, and then to be comfortable, f2, you need to be.
Paul Velasco:No, no that's not to be comfortable. We've got a big sponsor. He's sitting away here. Okay, be serious. How much would you need from now for you to get into and complete a season in formula 2 from now, in formula no, everything starting now, you you'd need I would say you'd need a season in formula three. You need a season in formula maybe two. No, you're old enough. Formula three, you just get yeah because you're smart and you're fast. So formula three and then formula two. So if you had to do a full season with the best team, prema, that's not, that's like a leader brother, get some guy pushing your car. You know, crema, you're Formula 3 and Formula 2.
Hugh Barter:How much would it cost you, I would say anywhere from 1.5 to 2. Wow, I've heard some pretty insane numbers. For Formula 3? For Formula 3? For Formula 3. I've heard some pretty crazy numbers $2 million.
Paul Velasco:No, I'm not surprised. I've heard stories of karting where you arrive there and there's russian olive box with motorhomes better than formula one ones and they're billionaires and if they don't like the team, they buy it. You know what I mean. It's like yeah, I've heard these stories, so I.
Rick Houghton:I put my son, who was six years old at the time, I put him into the british junior karting series and we turn up at race meetings and the rich fathers would buy a new engine for every single meeting. We had one engine for the season and one chassis for the season. The rich fathers would buy new tyres, new engines, new chassis for every single race. It must have cost them 10 grand per race meeting, but that's what they did and their kids won nearly every time. We were competing with one chassis, one engine, one set of tires that we used to shave at the side of the racetrack. For, for god's sake, you know it is all about the money and you'd be so surprised how much karting costs. At the age of six years, you know to compete on a competitive level. It's just it's's unbelievable that the amount of money that motorsport costs is really quite frightening.
Hugh Barter:Yeah, and I'd say it's only gotten worse, to be honest.
Paul Velasco:Yeah, every year it gets worse, yeah.
Hugh Barter:I was sort of lucky that I started karting just before it became very serious in Australia before you know Mick Doolin, yeah, yeah sure.
Hugh Barter:He bought Associate Karting Australia and then he set up a full championship. Before you know, mcdowell, yeah, yeah, yeah, he bought, he bought a social card in australia and then he set up a full championship. Because nationals in australia used to be a one round event, used to be one round, winner takes all and that was it. And then he brought in the like a series. So you know a championship. He had like five rounds, but because of that it became so expensive compared to what it used to be but listen back to your current situation.
Paul Velasco:If someone wanted to invest in you as a driver for formula three and formula two with a big team, the winning team, I'm gonna say prema, because I know prema, how much is it going to cost you? How much must that sponsor give you? How much sponsorship must you find? Do you think to do it comfortably? To do it that you arrive there, you're in the zone, you're not worrying that you're sleeping in a fucking tent or whatever. You doing the hot. No, seriously, you're in a hotel, that's true, though that's true.
Hugh Barter:It's like a. That's a big thing, because you rock up to the track and then sometimes you end up staying in a hotel, where it's like, if it's's scared, like you go to sleep at night and you're going to wake up with all your belongings gone.
Paul Velasco:No, seriously. So to do it properly, how much is it going to cost? How much sponsorship do you need Formula 3 and Formula 2?
Hugh Barter:I would say comfortably, not a worry is like 1.5.
Paul Velasco:For both series.
Hugh Barter:Ah, for just Formula 3. And then to do formula two, you probably need at least like two and a half. So you're looking five million dollars.
Paul Velasco:You're looking for five million dollars. Yeah, I would say what are you gonna give me for those five million dollars?
Hugh Barter:I'm curious because I've never got to hopefully a lot of wins, hopefully a lot of wins. The thing is is that I mean I would argue a lot of people will say to me like, oh, why don't you just go do like duty 3 or something in the meantime, while you like try and find the funding for f3 or whatnot? But the thing is is that it's also harder to find funding for those smaller series because the companies are less interested exposure they get less.
Hugh Barter:They get less exposure, or it's less. It's not in the, it's not in the feeder series to, and so I mean you could argue that F2 is probably maybe easier to find funding than F3 because well, it's one step away from Formula 1. But at the end of the day it's sort of it levels out regardless.
Paul Velasco:But we're going to follow your career and we're going to hope that maybe you can open some doors. I don't know. You know you've got to think out the box from a promotional point of view. Maybe we'll. We'll stay in touch and I'll share some ideas that I've got. And you know, end of the day, you've got to get yourself known. You've got to get yourself guested on podcasts. You've got to get yourself out there and I wouldn't say that doing occasional gt3 races and stuff like that's not a bad thing, you know, but you're too young you, I know guys who couldn't afford Formula 3, so they went GT4.
Paul Velasco:You know, that was also because you've got to remember one thing, hey and I'm saying this because you know when my son used to play soccer, he asked me one day we were coming out of a really good training and he said to me Dad, am I ever going to play for Real Madrid? And I looked at him and I said no, son, I don't think you are. It was madrid man. I looked at him and I said, no, son, I don't think you are. It was very tough for me to say that, but you have the spirit to do it. So I kind of softened the blow and I'm going to say to you it's very, very, very, very, from where I sit and listen, okay, to you it's very, very difficult for you to actually even make it close to formula one because you're up against guys with unlimited budgets. So you really have to find a way that is unique and I'm going to wish you the best of luck, mate. You know, and that's open doors. You know, the bigger your network becomes, yeah, correct.
Hugh Barter:I mean I mean the. I would say the main sort of thing that has worked for us finding scholarship is usually b2b contacts. I mean I would say that I'm pretty well connected now thanks to dad's networking skills your dad's a chef mate.
Paul Velasco:We've got to go to one of these races because we're going to eat really well at home.
Hugh Barter:Oh, chef by trade. So I eat really well on a race weekend because he cooks really good food for me at the AirBnBs that we stay at. Actually, mom's pretty good as well, so, yeah, the whole family's a good cook you.
Rick Houghton:Let me ask you you know, obviously we're talking about formula one in in our podcast and it's fascinating to hear about you and and the progress that you're making and the and the struggles really that you you coming up against, uh, with your journey into into top level motorsport. If I was to say to you, h, I want you to drive the second Red Bull Formula One car, how would you approach that? Because we've seen so many drivers approach it and fail. So many drivers have the mentality that, yeah, I can drive that and I'll drive the pants off it and then, when it comes down to the nitty-gritty, they really can't. How would you mentally and physically approach that sort of challenge, when we we already talked about adapting to different cars? How would you do that?
Hugh Barter:I mean, like you said yourself, the a lot of drivers say that, oh yeah, I would, I would do well, or I, I would adapt well. I mean, I think you're going to have that mentality, because if you don't think that, then I mean, what's the point of driving in the?
Hugh Barter:first place, yeah, and you got to keep thinking that, no matter what. I mean, I bet you that lawson probably still thinks that he can do that, and I wouldn't be surprised if he can. It's just a matter of actually executing it. And yeah, I, I would say it's also a big pressure thing, especially when you have mac and as your, as your teammate. It's not easy to just sort of hop in and be. That's the key compared against one of the best drivers probably on the grid. Yeah, but yeah, I, I would say yes, I would drive it, no matter what, but how would you approach it?
Paul Velasco:that's the key question, because would you, would you go with max's setup and try and drive it like him, or would you take it how would you? He has the keys, mate. You've got the red bull. You're going to drive it today in miami.
Hugh Barter:Yeah I mean the approach is to drive it as fast as as fast as I can. I mean it's. It's like if, if it's working for max, I mean, yeah, I'll drive whatever he's got, and then if I find something that works better for me, then I'll drive that. I mean, regardless, it's uh, it's my car, you know. You know, it's how I want to. If I want to drive it this way and we can get it to work going this way, sure, but the thing is what I think the problem is that the base of the car is made for max. So when you start to try and make it go the other way, you start losing time rather than gaining. So you need to drive it like max, otherwise you're not going to be getting the most out of the car.
Rick Houghton:Nice yeah, interesting, and do you think that's the mistake that other drivers in that second Red Bull car have made is that they've tried to make the car adaptable to their driving style rather than adapting their driving style to the car?
Paul Velasco:You're putting him in a spot mate.
Hugh Barter:I can't comment on that. I mean I don't know what the drivers are doing or what they're saying to engineers. I mean it's sort of I have. I mean, I drive professionally on the sim with a lot of different drivers and they all drive differently. All my teammates on the sim drive differently and we all have to adapt to each other and a lot of the time we will have two, two different setups on the car for two completely different driving styles and you end up having the same lap time. I mean, yeah, that's a sim, but that's just sort of like a example of like how, like you could go two completely different ways with like a setup and get the same result. But the thing is is that if I try and take, you know, my teammates set up and I try and drive it the way that I want to drive it and then try and adjust from that baseline the setup, it doesn't work.
Hugh Barter:I just end up going slower or it feels more comfortable, but I'm slower, you know, I think it's fascinating.
Paul Velasco:Listen, Miami man. This is a Miami Grand Prix preview. We're talking about more like it's used as a life story. So let's move to Miami. Not that the life story is interesting, because you're going to be back on here, we're going to follow you, but for now let's come on. Rick, what's happening with Miami? What do you want to know? You were sick, right? Explain.
Rick Houghton:I've been under the weather for the last week so I haven't really caught up with much F1 news because for two days this week I've been lying in a hospital bed. By the way, I'm fine.
Rick Houghton:Thank you for asking One thing I noticed about the build-up to no, I didn't get the flowers or the chocolates or the wine. One thing I've learned about the build-up to Miami Grand Prix this weekend is that the Ferrari looks horrendous. Do you want me to comment on that? Yeah, anyone. I mean, why would you have the red Ferrari and then stick a blue end on it? It just looks terrible.
Hugh Barter:My family is a whole bunch of designers, except my dad. So my sister's a communication designer, my mom's a landscape designer, so, yeah, I'm not too impressed either. I mean, I designed my own helmet and it's when they pulled the covers off. I was expecting like a, like a white livery, yeah, similar to what v car were running, and then I just pure disappointment listen, be careful.
Paul Velasco:Listen, we gotta be careful with you. You know what, if the Ferrari Driver Academy listens and he's slagging off their car? We don't want that Okay.
Rick Houghton:Maybe I can give them some tips. Yeah, but you know, even when Lewis pulled the covers back, I think even he went oh my God, is that what they've done?
Paul Velasco:To me it looks like a pizza with a big slab of blue cheese on the back Gatorade bottle next to it Blue cheese on the back and you know what?
Paul Velasco:Hey, I'm glad you said your sister's a good design person. I feel I've got a designer eye as a photographer. Why don't they just make that blue Ferrari red? It would look beautiful, it would look absolutely stunning, but they feel that they have to go and put the blue. You see, he's not going to comment because he knows that the road is listening and and he'll pack on my don't slag them off, you don't slag you to pack on, let me slag them off.
Rick Houghton:So you say, you guys and you hasn't said a thing about he'll pack on. He wants their sponsorship, mate.
Hugh Barter:Exactly that's why he's I gotta, I gotta stay swiss to stay Swiss, yeah, he loves HP.
Paul Velasco:No, listen, hp, guys. Seriously, your design dude needs to get a different design dude because, honestly, that car would look spectacular if you just took the blue and you kept it red. You'd still see HP. It's not like people think. Oh, it's a source. Everyone knows HP is a fucking printer. Anyway, move on guys. Hp is a fucking printer.
Rick Houghton:Anyway move on guys. And then, well, on the flip side of that, how good does the Racing Bulls look for this weekend? I mean that livery, oh, come on Pink.
Hugh Barter:You don't like pink. It looks great for Miami it looks great.
Rick Houghton:It's like the sunset in Miami on Ocean Drive. It looks good.
Paul Velasco:I get the whole Miami Vice thing okay with the toned colors and drive it looks good. I get the whole Miami Vice thing okay with the toned colors and shit the pink cars guys, jeez. No seriously Pink cars. I mean it's like super woke, the whole world's becoming unwoke and formula. So it's going to be like a gay parade, Miami downtown, all pink and like Cool. But listen, gay parades are fine, Beautiful people at gay parades. Miami Grand Prix a lot of pink. I'm not a fan of pink.
Rick Houghton:I quite like it. And it looks as though and again, I've not been as up to date as you guys probably have been this week, but again it looks like Mohammed bin Saleem is reversing his stance on swearing on team radios. Is this correct?
Hugh Barter:you were gonna I'm just out of that touch, as you I've, I've been, uh, I've been moving all week the swearing thing was just go.
Paul Velasco:It's like to me it's not, it's a non-issue. If a guy says fuck, he says fuck, you know he gets a hundred thousand bucks. It's not fair if you get five, because lots of people have a different language. So I swear a lot. My wife hates it, but that's just part of life. South africans, australians, mate, everything's like f this shit. But it's not malicious swearing, it's like frustration. Swearing, you know it's not like calling a guy a shit.
Hugh Barter:You know that's bad the thing is, I don't know. I don't know, like, where do you draw the line, though, like because I mean, if you look at tennis, they're not allowed to say anything at all, otherwise they get slapped with a code violation, and then after a couple then they get a fine. So you get at least a couple warnings.
Paul Velasco:At least you know so, yeah, it's a non-issue. Uh, rec, in my opinion, I mean, you know, really there's a lot, a lot better stuff happening. I'd say let me just check through what we've been reporting on here. Look, end of the day, let's talk about the championship cars. I don't care who comes seventh or eighth or ninth, let's talk about the championship. As far as I'm concerned, there's two dudes past you and marius, but there's max. You can never, you can never factor max out right. He's always in the gig.
Paul Velasco:My and this here's my introduction you can understand how I look at motorsport. The most important thing for a racing driver in a team like Formula One we're talking Formula One here. Other motorsports are slightly different, but it's the same. In karting and everything you have to beat your teammate, and the more you meet your teammate, the better and the harder, even though you'll go. Oh no, don't worry, mate, I only need one second quicker than you you go, I'm one second. That's how motor racing guys work. So you have to hammer your teammate. And Norris played the whole funny head game thing where he tried to get McLaren on his side and Piastri, being Piastri saw, look for McLaren to actually tell Norris to slow down and all that. That's not going to happen. I just got to kick his ass and that's what he's doing. That's my opinion. What do you reckon here?
Hugh Barter:I think, yeah, I agree with the whole like number one rule is beat your teammate. I mean, a lot comes from it. When you do beat your teammate, usually you start to get in their heads and it sort of becomes a snowball effect. I mean, at least Norris says he doesn't believe in momentum. I think there is always a little bit of momentum involved. I think it's easy to get out of bad momentum. So if you're on a bad roll, I think it's easy enough to get out of it. But I think once it starts snowballing then that becomes a big issue. And at the moment I feel like Piastri is doing a good job and I'd say a little bit in Norris' head at the moment, at least by the looks of it and the way that Norris speaks to the media.
Paul Velasco:Mate, you sound like Piastri.
Rick Houghton:In the sense of.
Paul Velasco:You speak really very calm, very nonchalant. Yeah, cool, calm, you know if I'd ever hold on if it was south africa. Yeah, I mean, I've said every no. You guys, you're just so chilled. You're like you know, if this was a british guy, the rick would be all over all the brits, you know.
Hugh Barter:But this is what I love about piastri and you guys is it's just you take everything in your stride and I'm seeing that in you and I would say the thing is, I think a lot of the time is like, when stuff happens, it's what we say shit happens, you move on. Next thing, it's like you can't change what's already happening, you just learn from it, and I'd say that's what is a good mentality to have, especially in racing. There's so many things that can go wrong, so why get stuck on that and not focus on what's coming next?
Rick Houghton:so, hugh, let me, let me ask you this we me and paul have talked over the last few episodes on the podcast about the mentality to become a world champion and we've said that world champions throughout history, you know, going back to, you know, to senna schacher they've all had this ruthless side to them where they are not prepared to give up an apex. And then we talked about Norris and last year probably could have been world champion if he'd have been more ruthless and the challenges he had with Max. He was giving up apexes into turn one, he was backing out of challenges. Do you think that you have to have that ruthless streak to become a world champion in any form of motorsport, or can you be a nice guy and still win 100?
Hugh Barter:I, I, I, always, I, I think. I think one of the reasons like this can be controversial topic, but in 2021, when Max and Lewis had the whole battle, I'd say in the second half of the season, especially after Singapore, lewis had the better car. The thing was that Max was leading the championship already and he wasn't really scared to lose like not finish a race, while Lewis had to sort of scrap every point to make sure that he was finishing in front of max. Well, max was sort of like well, if we crash, we crash. I mean, if you don't score points and I don't score points, then it's, it's, it's um, what's it called? Plus minus zero situation. So it doesn't really matter to him. And I think that's what sort of gave him the opportunity to come into the last round still in the championship fight, because in my opinion, lewis should have already come into the last round of the championship in front of Max, at least in my opinion.
Paul Velasco:Listen that Mercedes-Benz, unleashed from Brazil onwards, was the most powerful Formula One car in the history of Formula One.
Hugh Barter:Exactly exactly, and it was on rails. It was on rails. It was their best engine.
Paul Velasco:They took it from the very top shelf.
Hugh Barter:Trust me, I know that from inside and the thing is, is that because Max had nothing to lose I mean, you saw Monza I mean what he did was like on the limit of what was allowed, I would say. And then Brazil also the same thing yeah, you got. Did he get penalized in Brazil? I can't remember, but the thing regardless Did he get penalized in Brazil? I can't remember. But the thing regardless is that he was ready to put it all on the line and I'd say that paid off in the end. Now, obviously I'd say he got a bit lucky with the safety car and whatnot, but at least he put himself in the position to be there.
Paul Velasco:Which is your motto is never give up.
Hugh Barter:Yeah, correct, Exactly yes exactly, and I would say that you see that constantly. Uh, in max's racing you saw that in someone like michael. You see that even even with the center. I mean, you even saw the year that rosberg won the championship, I guess he turned into a ruthless bastard that year exactly exactly and, um, I mean it's a constant sort of effect that the previous world champions were like that.
Hugh Barter:I mean you saw Vettel in his first years 2010, 11, 12, 13. Brutal, brutal. What he did to Webber so often was sour. Exactly exactly, and I mean like.
Paul Velasco:But from their perspective they are not wrong at all. They are 100, right, I mean. The thing is, you can't think you're wrong.
Hugh Barter:If you think, remember that you start thinking you're wrong is like why are you doing in the first place?
Paul Velasco:you know it's like uh, now you're just being an asshole so the question then to you, to both of you guys who has more of? Who has that, that ruthless factor Piastri, between Norris, between Norris, no, the current batch, would you say. That's to analyze the guys that are in theā¦.
Rick Houghton:Oh, I would say Max, yeah, followed by Piastri. Okay.
Paul Velasco:Max is the benchmark. Yeah, Next.
Hugh Barter:Yeah, piastri's got it. Leclerc, leclerc's got it. I'd say Leclerc, leclerc's got it. I'd say Leclerc is more ruthless than Piastri in my opinion you think yeah, I would say, we haven't seen.
Paul Velasco:Leclerc Oscar's only got like 51 Grand Prix starts mate.
Hugh Barter:Yeah, and the thing is, though, leclerc has never been in the position to be finalist for the championship, but I would say that, if he was, he would be just as ruthless as Max We'll actually note that for the future, because that's an interesting one.
Paul Velasco:I don't see him as that. I think he's had it too easy. Charlie.
Hugh Barter:Yeah, maybe too easy, but I still stand by. He is by far one of the best qualifiers on the grid, by far. To put a one-lap pace together, I'd say he's one of the best. He hasn't done it for a long time, and comfortably. He hasn't done it for a long time. Okay, yeah, but you look at his stats like in no, look, they need to give Leclerc a decent car.
Paul Velasco:That's what they need.
Hugh Barter:Yeah, I agree, because not?
Paul Velasco:just a car that one day goes good and the other. You know what I mean.
Rick Houghton:It's tough, yeah yeah, back to Miami. It's race four at this circuit. Max has won it twice. Lando Norris won it last year in his debut Formula One win. Hugh, in your professional driver's opinion, what's the track like? Is it a track that you like to drive? I mean, I'm presuming you've driven it on the sim.
Hugh Barter:Yeah, it's okay. I mean, I feel like it's really awkward for a formula one car.
Rick Houghton:It's like the the, the bit before the back straight is always always just struck me as stupid.
Hugh Barter:Oh yeah, I don't really understand the point of that and it's not like. It's not like you can do a boot move either. I don't know if you know what a boot move is. It's like you know, when you have, like, a chicane and then instead of preparing the last part of the corner, you just go directly to the apex to make a move. It's not like you can do that in Formula 1 anyways. Like, especially in that type of corner, it just doesn't work.
Paul Velasco:Cars are too long.
Hugh Barter:Too long, they're too wide, they're just a bit of a mess.
Paul Velasco:It's built in a car park, guys. What do you expect? It is a car park.
Hugh Barter:But besides that, I mean the track is nice. I mean I wouldn't say it's likeā¦ it's not Jeddah, I don't know. Yeah, I mean it depends what you're looking for. As a driver, you're always looking for, like, high adrenaline tracks. As a spectator, you want to see lots of moves, lots of passing opportunities so don't you think there'll be much in miami?
Rick Houghton:that's a good follow-up. Actually, hugh, as a driver, when you come to a new track, do you look at the layout and think there's an overtaking move here, here and here. Or do you just think, oh yeah, I'm, I'm, you know, the adrenaline's going to be up because it's going to be fast. Uh, the walls are closed, so it's going to be exciting. Or do you instantly look for how you're going to get past your competitors?
Hugh Barter:well, I hopefully they don't have to get past anyone. If that's, uh, that's what I hope when I come into the round, uh, or the race, um, but yeah, I mean, I would say that's sort of something that, as a driver, you can kind of look at and instantly get, no matter what. And then what you're really looking at, be honest, is just how to drive the track as fast as possible. That's the first thing that you're looking at, no matter what.
Rick Houghton:Okay, let me ask you about how you view the addition of Kimi Antonelli to the Mercedes lineup. He's 18 years old. He's one of the youngest drivers on the grid. How have you viewed his sort of beginning in formula one?
Hugh Barter:I think he's doing a really good job. I mean I don't think he's doing a bad job. I think he's doing exactly what he needs to be doing to secure his place in mercedes for another year. And I think he's also doing a really good job learning from george. I mean, he's not there to go first season like the car is not the car is definitely not world championship winning material. So at the moment the best he can do is learn, give feedback on how he wants the car to be, because at the end of the day he will probably be the last person to leave mercedes. You know, I think george will leave before kimmy um, so they'll probably end up. What he's advice that he gives is probably what the car will be made around towards the end of his career or his time at Merck if he decides to leave or stay or what not. So I say he's doing what he needs to do to mould well with the team.
Paul Velasco:I think you're there in a good place, mercedes. I think Wolf got it right. You know he could have kept Kimi out for another year. He didn't have a great form of the tune, let's be honest, but he surprised everybody. He surprised me especially. I mean, I thought he was a bit young to go for it. But I think youth is where it's at, you know, and he's obviously not at George's pace, but no one expected him to be there. But he's not binning the car, he's bringing it home behind George.
Hugh Barter:That's really what you can ask, and it's not like he's a million miles off, george anyways, I mean he's like what, like one tenth one, and a half tenths or two tenths at Bahrain.
Paul Velasco:No he's there, look. I think he's in a very good place. I think he's one of the most impressive rookies. I mean Hadja, let's see. I mean I'm impressed with Hadja because I didn't have high expectations. But you know what, ed, I don't want to put you in a spot where if you criticize these drivers and they come and look for you in a pit and they beat you up one day. You know what I mean. So if you it's like we don't want you to, and this applies and this will be off the record, obviously, you know, cut it out. Don't feel you have to say anything that Kim Jepard owes you.
Hugh Barter:You know what I mean Because, honestly, yeah, well, I mean, at the moment, I haven't Not yet.
Paul Velasco:You nearly killed your Ferrari career, but anyway.
Rick Houghton:Let me ask about Ferrari, hugh Lewis Hamilton, and this is again it's about driver mentality. I think Lewis Hamilton has obviously had his struggles adapting to the Ferrari team and the Ferrari car. Are you surprised that he's made so many public comments about his performance and about his adaption to the team? So, for instance, unusually, hamilton has been has been making public statements in the media saying, uh, this is terrible, it's not going to improve by the end of the year, I can't drive the car. But I mean that seems. It seems like he's kind of admitted defeat publicly with adaption to the Ferrari car, whereas in previous seasons when he's had struggles with Mercedes, you see him say, oh, the guys will get there.
Paul Velasco:We're going to do this. We're going to do that. He never struggled with Mercedes.
Rick Houghton:Well, when they dropped off, after you know, he moaned a lot mate. But he was mostly positive.
Paul Velasco:Oh, this week we're not going to do anything.
Rick Houghton:But with the Ferrari now he seems to have admitted doom and gloom only four meetings into the season. Are you surprised by that, hugh?
Hugh Barter:I mean the thing is that I'd say usually Lewis is pretty verbal anyways on socials and he speaks what he thinks. I think it's just against sort of what Ferrari is usually used to. I say Ferrari can sometimes muzzle their drivers a little bit. But the thing is is that especially when you come into a new team, you don't know what to expect and things change and it's just uh, I don't think he knew what to expect. I don't think anyone knows what to expect when they change teams. Um, but yeah, obviously it's a big change for him. Other than that, I can't really comment on on if I think he's a bit of a defeat Personally. No, I don't think so, at least.
Paul Velasco:That's Lewis mate, lewis will. I'm going to say it for you if you don't mind. Probably not your word, but I love Lewis to bits, one of the greatest drivers this sport has ever seen. But increasingly he's just not the Lewis of old. I mean, he's admitting that and he is 40 years old. You know until at least 18. You know the energy levels, the whole like am I going to take this shitbox and drive it and try and kill myself or not? You know.
Paul Velasco:If you're 18, you're going to say, yeah, I'm going to drive this shitbox and try to kill myself like I did at Monza. Lewis, there's a self-preservation thing. We saw it with Alonso, we saw it with Vettel. I'm seeing and with all due respect to Lewis, like I said, you've got to call it as it is I'm seeing kind of a Vettel-ish decline. I mean, the sprint race in China was an anomaly. That said, hey, give me the right piece of kit, get the conditions right and I'll win for you. But apart from that, Lewis is in a situation that I feel Seb was at one stage. Charles is no slouch, he's very, very quick, but Lewis' decline. I hate to say it, but declines.
Paul Velasco:We started with Mercedes. You know Lewis was handed it by George last year. You know what I mean. George beat him. You know he made yeah, but obviously it was well-spent.
Paul Velasco:And the British media don't. They give Lewis a pass every time. He wears his heart on his sleeve. Mate, you never see a thing. When Lewis says it was horrible, we have to say it was horrible. The British media don't. I think they're turning.
Paul Velasco:When I say the British media, I'm talking more the Sky crowd that cover the sport. Those boys I love them. Some of them are really brilliant, but honestly, they just blow too much smoke at British asses. It's cool. I'm cool with it because, honestly, if speaking about Lewis in a way that British media would never say and saying things like Lewis is a great driver, great car, he's fantastic, but he's never had to really win with a bad car, apart from his McLaren days. He won one race in 2013, before the hybrid era, with the Mercedes, and we've seen Max win from 17 to a bad car and good cars and we've seen Alonso do stuff. So you know they're being realistic and I'm going to say this, and I say this for Alonso and I say it for Seb and all those guys that have had so much glory to go, after 20 years in this sport, to go and pedal a shitbox every Sunday for a year. Man, it's yeah. Can we demotivate him? That's my saying on.
Rick Houghton:Lewis, you know what I've got a point I'd like to make about this. I mean, we saw Verstappen miss media day yesterday because he was. He was pregnant, right waiting for the birth of his first child.
Paul Velasco:He was pregnant. Yeah, were pregnant. Whatever, that's a second gone mate Boom you know what?
Rick Houghton:Yeah, well, this is my point. When I used to race in the British Pro Kart Championship, I was fine, I was good, I was always, you know, up there and on it and I had my son was born. And a few weeks after my son was born my my first son I had to do a 24-hour pro kart race in dubai. I got to the circuit and went through my normal routine and my normal preparations and when I hit the circuit I was a second off the pace and I was like I don't understand this and it was because I just had a son. And suddenly you're aware of your own mortality. So suddenly that edge that you used to have as a driver to push it to the limit wasn't there anymore. And I find it fascinating, when Formula One drivers have kids, that they're still able to perform at the level they were before they had the kid.
Hugh Barter:Can I ask actually how old is Max 27 now and can I ask how old were you?
Rick Houghton:when you had your first, I was, yeah, about the same age, about 27, 28.
Paul Velasco:Yeah, okay.
Hugh Barter:No, I think you had the kid on the cart with you. I don't know.
Paul Velasco:I think you had the kid on the cart with you, I don't know.
Hugh Barter:Personally, I mean, I'm only 19.
Paul Velasco:You haven't had kids yet.
Hugh Barter:I'm not thinking about that yet.
Paul Velasco:I had kids and I went to Boston.
Hugh Barter:It entered my mind once On a simp. But the thing is that I don't know, I think Max has still sort of got that kid in him. I mean, he spends his weekends driving the Sim. It's sort of like I think he still he loves what he does and he's alive at the end of the day. He lives it, mate.
Paul Velasco:He lives this sport like no other racing driver in the history of the sport has lived it and I'm going to say this in the history of the sport has lived and the reason, and I'm going to say this I'm a Gilles Villeneuve fan.
Paul Velasco:I was an Ayrton Senna fan, hamilton fan and I can tell you straight out this kid is the best ever, because you know why. He has got tools like simulators, like all that stuff that no other driver had. You think if Senna was around in this era he wouldn't be as good as Max he would, because he'd be doing all the same shit Max is doing. That's the reality of it.
Paul Velasco:You have to eat, breathe, sleep this stuff, otherwise you're not. And that benchmark is what's great to do. You know, senna raised the benchmark, schumacher raised the benchmark, prost, you're looking Hamilton, vett, fettle, they all raised the bin and this guy's taking it to the next level. Yeah, that's why I don't envy you guys, because it's just the bar just got a lot higher for you kids yeah but I think it always does and I think, like like my generation, now we're all, we're all on sims.
Hugh Barter:I mean, look where I'm sitting right now I guess, like you know, it's the gt3 merc.
Paul Velasco:Are you driving a gt3 merc? What?
Hugh Barter:yeah, yeah, here's the, that's actually I racing at uh bathurst yeah, it is. How'd you?
Paul Velasco:get that, I'm surprised you got that yeah, gt3, because I know I drove I racing for 20 years I just did the.
Hugh Barter:In february I did the bathurst 12 hour that's just before the left hander. Yeah, before turn three, it is, oh my God, just from that one still picture.
Paul Velasco:Yeah, it is, yeah, it is.
Rick Houghton:Yeah.
Hugh Barter:Just for the double left of the hill through the cutting. Yeah, it is Okay.
Rick Houghton:So every week on the podcast we give our top three finishing order for the ground.
Hugh Barter:Over to you, hugh, the ground over to you, hugh, I'm gonna go piastri because, why not?
Rick Houghton:I'm gonna pass piastri the clerk norris. Oh no, max in there.
Paul Velasco:Okay, I want, I can't want the next one because I won the last. The last one, mate, I got, I got I called the three guys and, uh, it was right for qualifying but not right for the race man yeah, it, yeah, it was yeah. I'm going to say man PSG. I love that guy. Psg Max George.
Hugh Barter:Oh, I forgot about George. Yeah, oh, I fumbled. You can have another go.
Rick Houghton:To be fair, there's a lot of talk about George going into this Miami Grand Prix weekend. There's a lot of talk about him, you know, possibly dominating the whole weekend in every session. So that's a fair call.
Hugh Barter:I think, oh, the thing is, there's so many slow corners, so I think that Mocha's actually not a bad choice. I say so many. There's like a couple of slow corners, it's hard to tell.
Paul Velasco:But anyway, so you can play a wild card if you want. But I'm just, I mean Sergio, I mean there's no Ron Norris in mind and the no look, you know what's yours, rick?
Rick Houghton:I'm going for Norris Max George. Norris Max, george. No, Piastri. I think Piastri could have a, could have a stumble this weekend. I'm only saying that because he's not a great talent, because he clearly is and he's got a very cool head on those shoulders. But I think Piastri might find that he gets some sort of technical issue this weekend Sounds like you reading into a crystal ball in the movie.
Rick Houghton:Shake it the eight ball. I think Norris needs a mental win this weekend over Piastri, because otherwise it's going to be a struggle for him. So it's an emotional vote. Yeah, okay, that's interesting.
Hugh Barter:That's cool, that's fair. You see what I'm saying about the British goal.
Paul Velasco:I mean, if Logan Sargent was British, he'd still be racing, Anyway. Anyway, guys, hey, Hugh man, it's good to meet you and I'm actually going to lobby for us to do another one of these at some point.
Rick Houghton:Yeah, actually me too, hugh. I would love to have you on the podcast on a more regular basis. If you can do that with your busy schedule and stuff, that would be brilliant, because I think your insight is fantastic and it's really added to the podcast.
Paul Velasco:Yeah, I mean young and down full of cum. That's basically the kind of dude we need on here. No, no, seriously. You know it's very difficult to criticize your own. You know I'm a photographer. So if someone said to me you know this guy shoots this, you don't want to shit on his battery, you know what I mean. So what I'm saying is thank you for the candor that you showed and putting out some good soundbites.
Hugh Barter:Thank you for having me Cool. Yeah, no, of course, of course, Just yeah, don't cancel me.
Rick Houghton:Never. You'll never be canceled with us, hugh, that's for sure. Thank you so much. Thank you, paul. Please join us on the next episode of Two Soft Compounds when we'll be reviewing and looking back at the Miami Formula One Grand Prix. Two Soft Compounds was presented by myself, rick Hutton, alongside Paul Valesco. The studio engineer and editor was Roy DeMonte, the executive producer was Ian Carlos, and this podcast is a co-production between Grand Prix 24-7 and W4 Podcast Studio Dubai. Don't forget, if you want to join in the conversation, leave a comment on our Instagram page at 2softcompounds. We love getting comments, questions, and we'll give a shout out to some of the best ones on the podcast in the next few weeks. You can also email us at twosoftcompounds at gmailcom, and if you haven't done so already, please do click that follow or subscribe button. See you next time.